Public Safety Building Committee
Meeting Minutes
June 20, 2007
6:30 PM Holden Municipal Light Department
Present: Christopher Lucchesi, Bob Beck, Karl Makela, David White, John Chandler, George Sherrill, Richard Bates, Brian Forts, Mary Ryan, Peter Liddy, Bob Beck,
Hal Lane, David White
Others Present: Michael McKeon (of Kaestle Boos), Ken Costello (of Kaestle Boos)
Call to Order:
The meeting was called to order at 6:40 PM.
Approval of previous meeting minutes:
Mr. Makela made a motion to accept the minutes of the May 2, 2007 meeting as written. The motion was seconded by Mr. Beck. Mr. Liddy abstained. The minutes were accepted with no votes opposing. At the request of Chairman Lucchesi approval of the meeting minutes of June 6, 2007 will be deferred to the next meeting.
Public Comment:
There were no public comments/speakers at this time.
Comments from the Chair:
Information from the Town Manager was received regarding funds on the value of the WRHS properties (see handouts). Total acres are 3.54. The total estimated market value is $1,532,042.
The HoldenPSBC.org website was announced, and the public was encouraged to visit the website. Posted on the website will be various items of public information the committee has received as it has gone through its work. Currently, the Executive Order creating the committee, a committee member list, a photo slide show, and presentations made by Chairman Lucchesi can be found on the website. More will be added as time progresses and permits.
Chairman Lucchesi spoke to the Town Manager about approaching DCR about the land swap. No action has been taken yet.
The Executive Session minutes from May 2, 2007 need to be sent out for approval to Committee members.
New Business:
The next Public Safety Building Committee meeting will take place July 18, 2007.
Holden Days – Public Safety Session, PSBC should be there to discuss plans set up with Fire and Police Departments.
Chief Sherrill: Shared information about the Governor’s Office Program to finance Police Station repairs, new updates, etc. Unfortunately, only $2 million is available state wide with a 50/50 match.
Michael McKeon introduced Ken Costello, the landscape architect for Kaestle Boos. Kaestle Boos showed comparative numbers of other project costs. They took recent similar projects and showed them using today’s numbers. Cost analysis (on handout) is only a guide for comparison purposes.
Police @ $335 square foot
Fire @ $310 square foot
A power point presentation was conducted by Michael McKeon.
PowerPoint presentation
Kendall Road site: used Foxboro facility as an overlay and it does seem to fit.
Salisbury Street for police site / New Fire on Existing Site
Salisbury Street: DCR Property, 2+ acre portion of property, drops off steeply in back, clean site. Chief Sherrill asked if a fire engine bay can be added.
New Fire on existing site: Foot print from Cramer Site as an example, re-do of Bob’s Mitchell’s concept but lightened up, represents 20,000 square foot less halls, stairs, etc.
Sailsbury Street for police site / Fire Renovation and Addition
Cost review (handouts)
Combined: Site requires at least 2.6 acres.
Mr. Lane - # 1 most expensive option.
Mr. White - # 1 would give you the best facility. Put Fire Department on second floor. #1 gives drive through bay. The Salisbury Street land should be used for recreation and not the Police station.
Mr. Makela – Can we look at the Main Street property again? Is there sufficient land to have just a fire station if you only take three sites? If so, Salisbury Street would be good for the Police Department. Would both facilities fit on three lots; they may but it would be very tight.
Mr. White – Still taking recreation space and hamstringing the Dawson recreation area for future use.
Mr. Makela – Is it feasible to take out the property by the WRHS driveway?
Mr. Lane – Salisbury site is good. Public Safety is most important. We could rebuild basketball courts elsewhere on the property.
Mr. Costello – Could move the Police Department to the left and keep the basketball courts.
Ms. Ryan – The benefit of Salisbury Street could be a small sub station and maybe ambulance.
Chief Chandler – Not sure if the location would adequately cover South Salisbury Street.
Mr. Makela – If we are looking at 1.3 to 1.5 acres for a site, could we look again at Caswell King? Would a combined station fit?
Mr. McKeon - It is only 1.8 so it would only fit one facility, not both.
Mr. White - $1.35 million to take the property in the first option. Comparison of three projects, plus what we could get for selling the Police and Fire Department sites. The town loses money on single family homes, $5,000 to educate a kid in the school system is more that the property tax collected. In general there are less services if we eliminate the five houses.
Mr. Beck – The Kendall Road site is the best and would give the best potential solution for the architect to work with the best cost estimates.
Mr. Liddy – I agree….
Chief Sherrill – Water run-off issue for WRHS. What has DEP done, what is going on with the issue?
Mr. Costello – Knows the civil engineer who is working with the WRHS. They will ask if there will be a run-off problem if we built there?
Mr. White – Agrees with Mr. Beck about the Kendall Road site being the best option. He doesn’t necessarily agree with the square footage needed. There is no where to go but down as far as he is concerned. 36,000 Sq Ft?
Chairman Lucchesi / Michael McKeon – A combined facility would be in the neighborhood of 33,000 Sq. Ft. because of the efficiency of a combined facility.
Mr. Makela – How long will it take for the eminent domain process? Would the State Highway Department allow us to put in a new light?
Mr. White made a motion to pursue more answers to the Kendall Road site. # 1 to have discussions with Mass Highway, #2 to have administration discussions with property owners (friendly/hostile), #3 Preliminary design from Kaestle Boos, #4 request information on taking land by eminent domain and that the time frame would be. The motion was not seconded.
Mr. Lane – Can we put a sub station on the Salisbury site?
Mr. Makela – Would a combined PSB fit on the existing DPW site?
Mr. Beck – Doesn’t like option 2A. Firefighter parking too far away from the station.
Mr. Liddy – Let’s not make the WRHS mistake and do a renovation and see what the costs will be. We should pursue Main Street property and refine it and get more comfortable with it.
Mr. White – Chief Chandler, is there a value in a bay on Salisbury Street? Need to look at available personnel, but probably not.
Chairman Lucchesi – Let us take a better look at this site.
Mr. McKeon – New station on current site. Still a lot of unknowns and the costs could escalate. Concerns about fill and need to rebuild it.
Chairman Lucchesi – Should we drill some holes in the Fire Department site to see what is there and what we need to do? Could do some digging with the Town DPW?
Mr. McKeon – You can tell a lot by digging some holes.
Chairman Lucchesi – Will talk to the Town Manager about eminent domain and talking to the state.
We need to get from Kaestle Boos:
Stronger concept design at Kendall Road combined station.
Stronger concept design at Salisbury Street for the Police Department.
Stronger concept design at the Fire Department site for a new building.
Public Comment:
Sheila Bachant– Concerns with the property at Kendall Street. The hill is a piece of ledge and water has to go somewhere. Property may become a lake. Would like to hear more from the Chiefs. The “man on the street” wants to know what the Chief’s need. Concerned a lot about having all command in one station. Where would the fire training site be? Town should not be in the real estate business. Need to sell to the hard working people in town who vote. The burned Jr. High should have been a municipal office building. We need to look at 20 years down the road. Jefferson area is going to be a big growth area. The Police Department can be anywhere.
Karen Green – Not much discussion about purchase of Caswell King. Urged the PSBC to reconsider the CK property. It would be a great place for a police station. Could put the Fire Department and DPW on one of the other sites. We have an opportunity to prevent Walgreens.
Gary Gaskin – 1467 Main Street- lives at base of High School, on property being dicussed by the committee. High Street was the original Main Street in Holden. New Main Street was a swamp. His property is below grade level. Water table comes up to ground level in the Spring. Basement has two pumps. Water level is 5’ up to the walls on the outside. Regarding the ledge, he’s familiar with it and when he built his garage he had to go over the ledge. May have to blast.
John Lavacheck – 25 Windsor Circle. In regards to the Foxboro facility, jigs and jags are a good idea if it makes it look smaller. Make it look more economical. How does Chief Chandler feel about adding renovations?
Chairman Lucchesi suggested Mr. Lavacheck have a discussion with Chief Chandler for an answer to his question.
Mr. Makela – The issue of perception is a real thing. Has been resisting a combined facility as it was rejected twice. Seems too big if you combine them.
Adjournment:
Mr. Beck made the motion to adjourn the meeting. Mr. White seconded the motion. The vote was unanimous to adjourn. The meeting adjourned at 9:15 PM.
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